[This digest is the copyright of the Move "Useless Information" Mailing List. Re-publication or re-distribution of "Useless Information" content, in any form whatsoever, is expressly prohibited without prior written consent.] USELESS INFORMATION The Move Mailing List Digest Issue #418 December 5, 2002 In this issue: * Song Of The Week (week of 12/2): "Zing Went The Strings of My Heart" * Roy's greatest song? * Find Of The Week: "Best of the Move CD" (cont.) * Happy Birthday, Rob! * Wizzard fiasco 1973 (cont.) * Article: Releasing Rock Albums Again and Again (and Again) ============================================================== To POST TO THE LIST: Send an e-mail to: move-list@eskimo.com Move List Info & Archives: http://www.eskimo.com/~noanswer/movelist.html TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Send an e-mail to move-digest-request@eskimo.com with the word "unsubscribe" (no quotes) in the subject line ============================================================== Subject: Re: Song Of The Week: "Zing Went The Strings of My Heart" Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 02:18:50 -0800 From: Richard Messum Oh, dear. It was bound to happen. After a good long run of great Move & RW songs, SOTW now features the most embarrassing, cringeworthy item in the entire catalogue (IMHO, of course). Is there any of their songs which polarises us more? I suppose that its appeal (or lack thereof) depends entirely upon one's sense of humour, and this song simply does not work for me. (I think that "Fire Brigade" is hilarious, however.) One question: if you removed the vocals, would anyone recognise this as being performed by The Move? A good choice for SOTW, though, as it has elicited an unusually large number of responses. ********** Subject: Re: Song Of The Week: "Zing Went The Strings of My Heart" Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 09:40:43 -0800 From: "Greg Weatherby" Kevin wrote: > "Zing.. " > is in your face , knees up, how's your father and all that. It's a worthy > and important artifact to the Move canon and should not be buried under a > rock in Utah or left on the cutting room floor and incinerated as some > people have opined over the years. Kevin, a very impressive and impassioned plea to see the other side of "Zing", but, unfortunately, for me, the song remains the same (to quote the latter day Yardbirds). I still think that it's a waste of bandwidth on their first album. Maybe as a "throwaway" B side to one of their early singles, where I could have safely ignored it, it would have worked. But stuck there in the middle, with me, (to paraphrase Stealers Wheel) of the first album, nah. ********** Subject: Re: Song Of The Week: "Zing Went The Strings of My Heart" Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 23:41:06 -0800 From: PrimoChuck As pointed out, great bass solo which is better than King Curtis's sax solo in the Coasters' version of "Zing Went the Strings of My Heart." Was this Roy's first shot at being retro? Judy Garland (star of The Wizard of Oz) had a hit with this song. Roy chose the name Wizzard for his band's name. Why did Roy choose the name Wizzard? I have never heard the story about the origin of naming of Wizzard, but frequently have heard about the naming of "The Move." Anyone on the list know? Charlie Long Beach, CA ********** Subject: Re: Song Of The Week: "Zing Went The Strings of My Heart" Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 09:15:24 -0800 From: "Michael J. Cross" Hi All, Greg wrote: >And who mentioned "Ben Crawley"? Another waste of vinyl, what >possessed Bev to have to sing lead, his voice was suited for back-up >vocals (see "I Can Hear The Grass Grow"). I know I'm gonna be told >that I don't "get it", but to me, these 2 songs detract rather than >add to the Move legacy. Greg, how do you like "My Marge"? I'd put up a wad of cash to wager you don't dig "When Grandma Plays the Banjo", either. I find that the folks who don't like any one of those tunes tend not to like the rest of the odd diversions. Which is o.k. with me, but I happen to love them dearly. I think they add another dimension to the already multi-dimensional Move catalogue. Then again, I listen to Spike Jones, Roger Miller, and Eugene Chadbourne, so I'm predisposed to love those odd musical bits from Roy/Move. Besides, in the context of band member dynamics, sometimes these types of songs are a great release, a larf, a lark, and are a lot of fun to spring on people during gigs. Releasing such songs on vinyl must've given at least some of the members some rewarding feelings. Less Creepy than yesterday, Mike ********** Subject: Re: Song Of The Week: "Zing Went The Strings of My Heart" Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 01:46:48 -0800 From: "Greg Weatherby" Bob Hughes wrote: > But some of you guys just aren't any fun! Next thing you know, > somebody will be telling me that "When Grandma Plays the Banjo" isn't the > greatest song Roy ever wrote :) While not bad, cough cough, the greatest song that Roy ever wrote may be "Flowers In The Rain", rather than the above mentioned title. Greg chief fun killer it would seem ********** Subject: Roy's greatest song? Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:02:08 -0800 From: Lynn Hoskins Greg wrote: >While not bad, cough cough, the greatest song that Roy ever wrote >may be >"Flowers In The Rain", rather than the above mentioned title. I think if you ever said this to Roy he'd give you funny looks. ;) While I agree that Roy wrote some incredible songs in the early days of The Move, I think his finest Move songwriting work was on "Message From The Country." With that said, I don't think he really hit his stride as a songwriter until "Boulders" ... and then "Wizzard." "See My Baby Jive," for example, is a great moment in pop music history. I know a lot of Move fans cringe when they hear Wizzard (too sugary!) but his melodies are pop perfection. What do others on the list consider to be Roy's greatest song? ********** Subject: Re: Roy's greatest song? Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:22:29 -0800 From: "Bobby Sutliff" Jeez - what an unfair question!! But if push comes to shove I'd pick either "I Can Hear The Grass Grow" or "Omnibus". ********** Subject: Re: Roy's greatest song? Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:23:45 -0800 From: "Greg Weatherby" Lynn Hoskins wrote: >> While not bad, cough cough, the greatest song that Roy ever wrote >> may be "Flowers In The Rain", rather than the above mentioned title. > > I think if you ever said this to Roy he'd give you funny looks. ;) I have often found that artists are the worst judge of their own material, especially as to what's the best or what's the worst. They are usually so wrapped up in their material, that they cannot step back and look at their work dispassionately. Of course, there is always the issue the subjectiveness of what's good and what's bad. You know, the old cliche, "one man's meat is another man's poison" or woman, as well, since they wrote cliches back before.....aw, that's another story. So, I would take the funny look from Roy, shake his hand for writing some incredible material, and tell him that "Flowers In The Rain" or "I Can Hear The Grass Grow" were his best material. Of course, how those particular songs effected me at the time also comes into play on my choice(s) for the best song. Greg pot stirrer, I guess ********** Subject: Re: Roy's greatest song? Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:24:03 -0800 From: "Doyle, Joe" >......What do others on the list consider to be Roy's greatest song? My favourite used to be Meet Me At The Jailhouse, however with the release of Main Street I have real difficulty deciding between French Perfume and I Should Have Known. ********** Subject: Re: Roy's greatest song? Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 12:24:28 -0800 From: "Michael J. Cross" Roy's greatest song? Wow....titles flood the mind...I think everything on Mustard is just beautiful. I'm thinking "Eyes of a Fool" and "Any Old Time Will Do" in particular. Actually, I think Roy's best song is "Too Good For Me", which I always wished was a stand-alone single (the instrumental "Second Class" was a great treat on the Movements boxset). Can't you just hear RW's Army doing a great job with that number? Mike Cross, Rochester, NY ********** Subject: Re: Roy's greatest song? Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:51:34 -0800 From: "Steve" I'll go with "It Wasnt My Idea to Dance". It was the one song that hooked me on the band. I had Shazam and looking on...but dance just flipped me out when it came out...it is so heavy. Still love it to this day. close second - fire brigade. ********** Subject: Re: Roy's greatest song? Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 13:52:04 -0800 From: John DeSilva This is a really difficult question because it's so tied to personal tastes, definitions of "greatest", and other intangibles. So I'll try to give a few answers (hell, I could damn near put every song he ever wrote as his greatest, but that would be ridiculous!): Greatest pop song: "Blackberry Way" Greatest rock song: "Brontosaurus" Greatest lyric imagery: "I Can Hear The Grass Grow" Greatest 'B' side: "Omnibus" Greatest "timeless" song: "I Wish It Could Be Christmas Everyday" Greatest guitar-based song: "Cherry Blossom Clinic Revisited" Greatest epic: "Meet Me At The Jailhouse" Greatest pastiche: tie - "Angel Fingers" and "French Perfume" Greatest song for Carl to sing: "Beautiful Daughter" Greatest song for Roy to sing: "Fire Brigade" ... and my personal pick as his all-time greatest song: "The Battle Of Marston Moor" !!!!!! no, no, actually my choice is: "Cherry Blossom Clinic Revisited" As my friend Greg pointed out, songs are held in high esteem based on several personal factors ... as for me, this was the first Woody song that just flat knocked me out. It has every element I love about Roy's writing and playing - for my tastes it's pretty much a perfect song in every way. But then again, what do I know? I do know what I like ... JD San Jose, CA ********** Subject: Re: Find Of The Week: "Best of the Move CD" Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 09:14:58 -0800 From: kakman "Tyler C.Sherman" writes: >Run, do not walk, back to the store where you saw the EMI "Best Of The >Move" CD and buy it before someone else does. This long deleted US >reissue is excellent ...AND getting very hard to find. Way back when >it first came out, I.C.E. rated it very highly, and they are particularly >persnickety about CD sound quality. Also, it contains a couple of >interesting "hidden bonus tracks". I won't say any more about that so >as not to spoil it for you. Tyler, You're getting this mixed up with EMI's 1994 "Great Move!The Best Of The Move", which contains "Message From The Country" and all the Harvest singles (A's + B's) plus two hidden cuts. What Joseph is referring to is A&M's 1989 CD release of it's 1972 double LP collection, "Best Of The Move" , which has liner notes by Bev Bevan (c. 1973) and includes both Deram singles and all the A&M singles by the Move in the U.S, plus the first official stateside appearance of their first album, "Move". This item was deleted almost immediately after its release. The sound is not bad on this CD, and it does include "Move" and Bev's nice commentary. I'd hie back to the shop and snap it up if I were him anyway. Kevin Kunreuther Dallas TX ********** Subject: Re: Find Of The Week: "Best of the Move CD" Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 00:10:57 -0800 From: "Tyler C.Sherman" Thanks Kevin, I was not aware of "The Best Of The Move" as a duplicate of the A&M 2 LP set as CD reissue. So now I have another oddity to search for. ********** Subject: Re: Find Of The Week: "Best of the Move CD" Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 09:17:56 -0800 From: LPJim To the finder of the BEST OF THE MOVE CD - buy it immediately. It's been out of print over 10 years and is becoming a valuable rarity. Fortunately I've got a copy and the sound is excellent. Also I concur with the writer seeking a source for autographed Move albums/items to complete his collection. This could be done online thru the website and would be a major boost to sales of new solo & collaborative projects from the band members. Hope to see this happen in the near future. Cheers, JB ********** Subject: Re: Find Of The Week: "Best of the Move CD" Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 10:02:29 -0800 From: Lynn Hoskins Kevin wrote: >What Joseph is referring to is A&M's 1989 CD release of it's 1972 double >LP collection, "Best Of The Move", which has liner notes by Bev Bevan >(c. 1973) and includes both Deram singles and all the A&M singles by the >Move in the U.S, plus the first official stateside appearance of their >first album, "Move". Isn't it funny... I just moved into my new place... my living room is filled with high stacks of boxes (and of course they aren't properly labeled so I have no idea what's in them)... but I know EXACTLY where my Move/ELO/Roy/Wizzard LP collection is. Priorities! I don't think anyone's mentioned that the LP in question, "The Best Of The Move," is the one with the illustration of a moving van on the cover. I never see this in the used bins, but if I ever do I'll grab it for someone on the list. I'll type up the liner notes for the list over the next couple days - Bev had some wonderful things to say about The Move. ********** Subject: Happy Birthday, Rob! Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2002 00:32:27 -0800 From: Lynn Hoskins Please join me in wishing Rob Caiger, our favorite producer and archivist, a very Happy Birthday. He's probably crawling around in some cluttered, dusty tape vault as we speak, searching relentlessly for original multi-tracks, alternate takes and never-heard rarities. Shall we let him have his birthday off? ;) Cheers to you, Rob! I know I speak for everyone when I say how much you are appreciated. (Rob's e-mail is corinthian@dial.pipex.com for anyone who wants to drop him a private greeting.) ********** Subject: Re: Wizzard fiasco 1973 Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 02:28:06 -0800 From: John Van der Kiste "Pekka Leikas" wrote: >This incident happened at the Ruisrock -festival in Turku; Finland, >August >-73. Circa 20.000 people attended. Roy Wood´s Wizzard were >engaged as the >headliner. Other artists included Vinegar Joe, >Savage Rose, Wigwam (our >own pride, still is), John Martyn and Status Quo (hmmm...). > >One radio journalist told how the situation developed at the backstage: >"Roy Wood seemed to be in a dejected mood beforehand and the >make-up >emphasized his countenance. He became even more gloomy when >he saw how >popular Status Quo (s***!)was. When he was just about to >enter the stage >he guessed he wouldn´t get a proper contact with the audience after >Status Quo (f***!). The last straw was when a Finnish "musician" >harassed >him and kept on repeating things like "Do you know that >Lloyd Green >piece?...Do you remember?...Hey! Roy! what about...". >Roy just had enough >and nearly beat the idiot up." Sorry but someone has to say it. It may not be the done thing to admit to being a Status Quo fan, but was it really necessary to spoil this post by childish digs at them? ********** Subject: Re: Wizzard fiasco 1973 Date: Tue, 3 Dec 2002 13:48:10 -0800 From: marmil (Marc) Any idea how many times Roy has played in Finland in the last 30-odd years? ********** Subject: Re: Wizzard fiasco 1973 Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 09:16:48 -0800 From: Zabadak (Rick) Sorry for the off topic post ..but due to the recently set precedent of Dave Edmund's postings (who BTW was ab fab in a show w Marshall Crenshaw)..i need at come out o the Quo closet. The thought of billing R.W.W. atop S.Q. is daft. Surely Roy must not have known who the "warm up" band was. ********** Subject: Re: Wizzard fiasco 1973 Date: Wed, 4 Dec 2002 22:36:28 -0800 From: Lynn Hoskins John Van der Kiste wrote: >Sorry but someone has to say it. It may not be the done thing to >admit to >being a Status Quo fan, but was it really necessary to >spoil this post by >childish digs at them? Hi John, I'm not sure that being a Status Quo fan is something to be ashamed of. I know the band has gone through some rough patches, including a cabaret phase (as did The Move), but they seriously rock! Other reasons to like Status Quo: - They did a great cover of "I Can Hear The Grass Grow" on their 1996 covers album "Don't Stop." - They appeared on "All This And World War II" soundtrack (along with Roy Wood, Jeff Lynne and others.) - The Rockers! John Coughlan joined Roy Wood, Phil Lynott and Chas Hodges on "We Are The Boys" (okay, I know a lot of Roy Wood fans don't like this song but *I* like it... ;) - The Quo had the good taste to ask Carl Wayne to join their band when The Move split up. - "Pictures of Matchstick Men" ...to name just a few. Sounds like Roy was having a REALLY bad day at that '73 Wizzard concert in Finland. I'd be very surprised if he held any grudges against Status Quo. ********** Subject: Releasing Rock Albums Again and Again (and Again) Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 02:31:51 -0800 From: Richard Messum Hi, all~ This piece, which comes from the New York Times business section, should be of interest to us all: November 25-----Critics have called the rock singer and songwriter Elvis Costello many things over the years: clever, angry, moody, humorous. Sean Murdock, a 34-year-old fan from Bergenfield, NJ, would like to add one more adjective: addictive. "When you're really a fan, it's like crack," he said. "You want everything that artist has." That must be music to the ears of executives at Rhino Records, who last week released three new editions of vintage Costello CDs, each with a second disc of bonus material. Mr. Murdock said he would pay for the updated version of 1982's "Imperial Bedroom," the third time he will have bought the same album. He had already replaced his vinyl version when Rykodisc rereleased the album with 9 extra tracks in 1994. Now, he will get an additional 14 songs from the vault on the new set from Rhino, part of the Warner Music Group. Record companies are increasingly and repeatedly releasing similar "deluxe editions" of albums---usually sporting improved sound, extensive liner notes, and bonus songs. The third CD incarnations of both David Bowie's "The Rise & Fall of Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders From Mars" (1972) and the Who's "Live at Leeds" (1970) recently hit stores. And Marvin Gaye, the Cars, John Coltrane, Bob Marley and Velvet Underground are among many musicians getting a second CD go-round with expanded albums. But with the proliferation of deluxe reissues comes a pressing question: How many times can record labels seeking to bolster their bottom line entice consumers to buy the same album---even with bonus songs---before generating resentment? "It's infuriating to me," said Tod Hensley, a 33-year-old from New York who has bought Mr. Costello's "My Aim Is True" (1977) and "This Year's Model" (1978) three times each. But Mr. Hensley directs none of his anger at Mr. Costello. "I just can't see him saying, 'Okay, I'm going to screw these guys over by redoing this all over again,' he said. "If he did do that I would be very disappointed. But I like to chalk it up to corporate greed." Mr. Costello does not have much sympathy for Mr. Hensley's views. "If people still have interest in the records, even if they have bought them before, I'm offering them the opportunity to hear them in perhaps the most complete way," Mr. Costello said. "It really comes down to their bank book and how they feel about it. I'm sorry if they feel that they're being coerced, but they really aren't. I mean, they have free will." Rebuying comes with the avid fan territory, said Luke Pacholski, who is such a devoted follower of the Who that he has paid three times for "Live at Leeds." After buying the CD version of the original six-song album, he bought the expanded edition in 1995, then the two-disc set with a live rendition of the rock opera "Tommy" issued last year. He fumes a bit, though, when new great-hits packages offer only slightly different features. Though the Who have released 11 studio albums, the band has put out 8 American best-of compilations. Label executives do not have a formula to calculate how many fans they can upset and still turn a profit. "But those questions always get asked," said Alex Miller, senior vice president of BMG Heritage. This year, Mr. Miller has overseen reissues of Lovin' Spoonful albums and Lou Reed's "Transformer" (1972). Still, the financial risk is relatively small. The cost for creating reissues is a fraction of making a new album, because the recordings were paid for long ago and ad campaigns are typically modest. Music labels often have to sell 50,000 to 100,000 copies of a new major-label album by a new artist, or a half-million for an established hitmaker. To start making money on the latest version of "Transformer," BMG Heritage will have to sell between just 5,000 and 10,000 copies, Mr. Miller said. The Who will have to sell more than 10,000 copies of next year's third CD edition of "Who's Next" (1971) to recoup its costs, said Andy McKaie, Universal Music Enteprises' senior vice president for artists and repertoire. Still, the number is less than needed for a new album. "If I were a consumer, it would rankle me a little bit" to see yet another version of the album in stores, Mr. McKaie said. Nonetheless, Universal executives will not set the list price on deluxe editions below $29.98. The case of the reappearing Costello discs is a matter of the singer periodically regaining control of his catalog. As he took his work from Columbia to Ryko to Rhino, each label changed the packaging and content of the albums. The fans appear to have followed. The double-disc "My Aim Is True," Mr. Costello's first album and one of his most popular, has sold 44,000 copies since its rerelease in August 2001, according to Neilsen SoundScan. The less well known "Blood & Chocolate," released originally in 1986, has sold 12,000 copies since its release in February. More deluxe editions are inevitable, and not just for classic rockers. Indie favorites Pavement recently put out a double-CD version of their 1992 album, "Slanted & Enchanted." And who knows what will happen when new remastering technology is available or more vintage tapes are uncovered in company vaults or under drummers' beds. BMG added just two of a possible 15 extra songs onto the rerelease of Mr. Reed's "Transformer." Can fans look forward to yet another edition of the album? Don't rule it out, Mr. Miller said. "What's going to happen in 5 or 10 years I couldn't tell you."---by Chris Nelson --- More stress upon our CD-buying budgets! Cheers Richard End of Useless Information #418 ******************************* [This digest is the copyright of the Move "Useless Information" Mailing List. 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