[This digest is the copyright of the Move "Useless Information" Mailing List. Re-publication or re-distribution of "Useless Information" content, in any form whatsoever, is expressly prohibited without prior written consent.] USELESS INFORMATION The Move Mailing List Digest Issue #447 February 20, 2003 In this issue: * Ace Kefford in new Mojo * ELO2 * The Move with no Woody * Not mocking or pooh poohing the passion * Bev's question: The Move without Roy? * A 'Woodless' Move (cont.) * Roy 'Reissue' Wood * Between the Devil & the Deep Blue Sea * A "Moveless Roy" * Re-formation of The Move * ELO2 info on Face The Music Online (cont.) * Retiremant? What retirement? ============================================================== To POST TO THE LIST: Send an e-mail to: move-list@eskimo.com Move List Info & Archives: http://www.eskimo.com/~noanswer/movelist.html TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Send an e-mail to move-digest-request@eskimo.com with the word "unsubscribe" (no quotes) in the subject line ============================================================== Subject: Ace Kefford in new Mojo Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 03:04:08 -0800 From: Lynn Hoskins Thanks to Jeff Cooper for typing this up for us. The Move Online (www.themoveonline.com) has been updated to include a news item on Ace. ---- Nice to see Rob's name in lights! Here ya go... :-) From Page 1 of The Buzz from the Mojo Collections section of the latest issue (112). The English Eccentric? Mercurial ex-Move 'Ace Face' resurfaces. Chris 'ACE' Kefford, perhaps the last forgotten hero of British pop, may yet take up his place in history. A long-lost album project, recorded after the fiery bassist walked out on The Move in 1968, has been unearthed following a lengthy search by Move/ELO researcher Rob Caiger. It's likely release later this year will be the first 'new' Ace Kefford record since 1969 when he appeared on two little-known singles. "I finally found the multi-tracks a few weeks ago", says Caiger, "and we've just finished mixing them down. There's some excellent material there, including a session with Jimmy Page." The recordings - produced by The Move's arranger Tony Visconti - were left unfinished after Kefford suffered a breakdown, and there is a distinct possibility that some old friends might be joining him in a studio to add the finishing touches. "Carl Wayne is readying to come in and record vocal overdubs," Caiger reveals. If they do, it'll be the first time original members of one of Britain's classiest pop acts have met in a studio for 30 years. After sessions for the album collapsed, Kefford battled his various addictions - a struggle he began to overcome in the late '80s. Currently "refamiliarising himself with his music", Ace returns later this year when the album Ace The Face, is released by Sanctuary. See also www.themoveonline.com. Jeff Cooper ********** Subject: ELO2 Date: Wed, 19 Feb 2003 18:45:30 -0800 From: Richard Brown Okay...delurking for questions. I actaully saw a little blurb (quoteing Rob) in ICE and had come to check my Move List for details....the ELO II release will have a bonus disc of unreleased ELO material with Roy...am I reading that right? And a track with Carl singing? Am I understanding this correctly? And the autographed copies....autographed by whom? Where do I sign up?! Gratefully, Rich B in Oklahoma USA ********** Subject: The Move with no Woody Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 01:08:51 -0800 From: Andrew Footman It would not be the Move without Roy. They would really need to use another name. Maybe name theirselves after one of the Move singles. Firebrigade springs to mind. That way they could say they are all members of the Move without people thinking Roy is missing. You see a lot of bands like Sweet which only haves 1 member and if you take the bands history into account there are no original members on board. I would not like to see just 2 or 3 members of the band calling themselves the Move. It would be wrong, you end up feeling short changed. If Roy wrote new songs for them without playing with them it would change things a bit. They would then still be the Move. Just that Roy would be a Keith Ried (Co wrote most of Procol Harums songs but never played or sang on their records) type member of the band. I would love to see them even without Roy but dont call yourselves Move 2. Who knows even Roy might turn up to see them and get on stage and sing a song or too (heres hoping anyway.) I believe Carl wanted to do this just before he left the Move when Roy wanted to form ELO. At that time Roy said he needed to keep the Move going for a while to help pay for the ELO project. This was a big factor in Carl walking out of the Move. At that time Carl wanted to bring Trevor and Ace back and Roy to still write songs for them. Would Roy want to Write new songs for the Woodless Move? Another factor to consider is Carl is the singer of the Hollies now. Will this mean he will leave them. If so that would upset the fans of that band. Trevor's own Band also gigs a lot too. Will they find time to fit this in.The Hollies play all over the world, would Carl want to leave them? I hope that Carl, Bev, Trevor, Ace and maybe Rick will do a load of gigs. But how will they play any of Shazam without Roy's input. They would have to limit themselves to the early part of their career. Which is still great, but no Hello Suzie, Beautiful Daughter, crying shame that is. ********** Subject: Not mocking or pooh poohing the passion Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 03:14:48 -0800 From: kakman1 I just wanted to add I'm not knocking Roy or anyone's passion or fervour for him, in light all the recent discussion centering around Bev's interest in reforming the Move without Roy and also Roy's seeming disinterest in his back catalogue and his reputation. Like many list members, I get a nearly indescribable thrill when I hear the sweet sonic ambrosia of a Roy Wood recording, no matter if it's a Move, ELO, solo or Wizzard/Wizzo/Helicopter opus. Knowing and hearing Roy's contributions on other people's records like Jimi Hendrix's Experience's "You Got Me Floating" or The Beach Boy's "It's O.K." is like being in on some 'state secret'. Recently, 'educating' a couple of Cheap Trick fans about the original versions of "California Man" and "We're Gonna' Rock'n'Roll Tonight" gives me hope that I can turn on more people to the talent and magic that is Roy Wood. But as fervent as I am in my own passion, nay, say love of the music of the Woodmeister, I also tend towards what I would call a pragmatic and scholarly approach concerning the music, the man and his career (oddly enough, I've never got into the wanting to know about his personal life). One of the running themes I have noticed about Woody's career, is that he prefers to be in bands when everyone gets along and there are no hard feelings. He tends to shy away from confrontations unless backed into a corner or if it is a matter of personal honor. And though of late he more or less tours to pay the bills by playing the old hits time and again, he does like to seek out and experiment in new musical directions. For the first half of his career, a good part of this musical growth was conducted under the glaring eye of joe public. After the commercial failures of his late seventies ouvre and what appeared to be some half hearted forays during the eighties, it appears a lot of that music is now made for his own amusement or satisfaction in studio, very rarely seeing the light of day either as the odd pop single or enhanced CD, in concert or a few bootlegs that got snuck out the door. There was recently talk of him rehearsing new material featuring salsa and debuting a new band as the Meringue Dance Oquestra, but little seems to be happening on that front. His appearances on quiz programmes, topical comedies, cooking segments, etcetera are done for his own amusement. Since he manges his own affairs for the most part, he sees no reason to preserve whatever image he may have had in the past, locked in his fans' minds, trapped like an insect in amber. Nevertheless, Roy seems quite content to move at his own pace and not be budged by the bustle or expectations of the pop world. Yes, there are some instances Roy could use shall we say 'encouragement', but I think Rob Caiger for the most part has got that covered, as far as collecting, preparing and sorting out the back catlogue. But when your love and devotion gets a little bent to the point of overt frustration, insulting and venting negatively on the list is not gonna' encourage anybody to do anything, and remember, Roy used to be managed by Don Arden! ;0) As fans all we can do is buy the new music, attend the shows when we can, visit the web sites and talk to each other and offer support via the list. We want more, we can not wait, but that is our lot I believe, nad hey , anticipation is part of the fun. We should consider ourselves fortunate that members of the Move and Wizzard and other friends and associates of Roy do take an interest in our little forum and occasionally get involved and participate. We are taken that seriously. After all that, I have to say The Useless Information and Showdown lists are bar none the best and most striking, colourful, devoted and informative bunch I could ever converse with, on the Internet or anywhere else. Kevin Kunreuther Dallas TX ********** Subject: Bev's question: The Move without Roy? Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 10:37:22 -0800 From: "Jeff Cooper" Hmmm... Lets see.... Bev Trevor Carl Rick Price? Ace?? Jeff Lynne????? (oh, okay not very likely I know!) Of course I'd wish for Roy to be involved but if thats not possible then... to see this lot on stage, playing Move songs... You bet I'd be there! ********** Subject: Re: A 'Woodless' Move Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 12:09:50 -0800 From: MontyDaman (Harold) Quoting Bev: >A3: OK. The million dollar question. Roy has made it pretty plain that >be is not interested in re-forming the 'Move'. He's also shown no >objection to a re-formation of the band without him. I'd be genuinely >interested in what everyone who logs on to 'useless information' >thinks about this. Would you attend a 'Woodless' Move performance? It "wood" be weird but I "wood" catch a show if it came near my area. Geez, this is hard to even think about! The Move without Roy? He's been in every incarnation of the band. I'm sorry but I think a project like this wouldn't "move". Biggest reason for this in my opinion is his vocals on songs can't be replaced. Closest I've ever heard DID come from Carl Wayne. Carl can sing sounding like Roy so well it's almost scary. Carl is busy fronting with the Hollies just now anywho! ********** Subject: Re: A 'Woodless' Move Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 10:38:50 -0800 From: "Steve Graham" I don't see how you could have a Move reunion without the 'Main Man'...that doesn't mean some of the other guys couldn't get together under a different name though? Might be interesting. As for one of the earlier posts berating Woody for being lazy and a few other messages advising Roy as to what he should be doing.....I would say he IS already doing what he wants to do????? too bad if that doesn't coincide with what we think Roy should be doing! ********** Subject: Roy 'Reissue' Wood Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 03:15:38 -0800 From: "DAVID BURLEY" Andrew Footman writes: >Again it appears Roy is his own worst enemy. I find it hard to >understand why he shows little interest in his own work. No wonder >the master tapes are missing to some of his stuff. He appears to me >anyway, to seem not worth his effort or his time to sort out the mess >his own back cat' is in. I guess poor Rob must bang his head on the >table trying to get Roy to do anything. A lot of people blame Rob for >the delays but it looks like Roy is the problem! Didn't I read somewhere Bev Bevan's comment that Roy Wood's biggest problem was his laziness?? Seems to me that Roy needs a manager. A good one. But maybe he's happy with what he's doing: sporadic gigs, bit of writing... And why not? He's given us enough pleasure over the years, how dare we ask for more? Why should HE want more? Maybe he receives sufficient income from old recordings. But then I keep remembering about his 'forthcoming' Salsa project. How long has this been 'forthcoming'? Several years now? I believe that if he's to get anywhere with a new project he needs to become high profile first. That means remastering/reissuing all his old stuff (at least get involved in it!), a big promotional exercise (magazine, press interviews, radio and TV appearances) AND a proper tour. THEN there will be sufficient market interest for a new venture. At the moment it appears that Roy himself is disinterested. Anybody got any thoughts on what has to be done to get Roy exactly where he should be? What can we do to convince him? Regards David Burley NP: Oh what a shame. ********** Subject: Between the Devil & the Deep Blue Sea Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 13:54:02 -0800 From: "David Woodier" The recent posts around Bev and the Move and Woody of would he not have made me ponder. The questions I have are what do I want/expect from Roy and what does he want to do/give me? I do not care what the other guys do, if Roy doesn't want to be in the Move then good on him, but they should not be allowed to call it the Move! I want to hear new material, either brand new or unreleased archive stuff - personally I can live without the re-mastered, but I WOULD buy them and very much appreciate the efforts of Rob in trying to establish some sense of dignity/pride and ownership in the output. What have I had since 1986?, a couple of CD singles, consisting of mainly reworkings, and the brilliant Main Street. What about Mega Dance Orquestra? and the stuff that the Novello award inspired Roy to go home and write? I love to see him play live. Saw Wizzard in '73 and then only caught up with the BB in '92 at the NEC and probably been to 25/30 gigs since then. But I have made a conscious decision not to go to Bilston in March. Why I hear you ask, well although money is not the main reason it has to be considered (as well as all the releases) but the biggest thing is the set list. It has hardly changed in the last 11 years, I recall 2 or 3 songs dropped from a few years ago and 1 or 2 added. But it does not give me the lift or buzz I use to have. Despite meeting some good mates at these shows and yes appreciating the UK gets more opportunities to see the same set!!! I am a ROY WOOD fan and always will be. I will support him through buying what I believe represents good value or should be part of my collection. Rob has had a great influence on that and long may he continue. My 4 and a half year old son wants to have the Woody Wood CD (Singles) on in the car and he really goes for it On Grass Grow!! I will go to another concert, even if the set list hasn't changed but I won't go to 3 or 4 a year. What I do want, or I think would answer a lot of gaps the list has are: and maybe Rob or Lynn are the closest to answer, assuming Roy wouldn't- 1) Does Roy do it for the love or the money, does he want to be a commercially successful artist again? 2) There are never any reasons why things don't happen I.e the Alive CD, Mega Dance Orq etc. - so we all make assumptions, feel let down, when a simple explanation may just do the trick? 3) Is the Salsa stuff ever going to see the light of day or is the set list fixed? 4) Would Roy come and have a beer or two with me and we can just talk the night away? PLEASE PLEASE do not think I am criticizing, I am not. I just believe that some rationale around why things do not happen when Roy says they will or are likely to would make the wonderful world of Wood that more enjoyable. All the best Dave ********** Subject: Re: Between the Devil & the Deep Blue Sea Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 16:16:53 -0800 From: "cuselton" David Woodier wrote: >4) Would Roy come and have a beer or two with me and we can just talk >the night away? If he ever said "Yes", I'd send you money so that you two could have lots of beers! thanks! cu tornado alley, ok ********** Subject: A "Moveless Roy" Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 16:16:16 -0800 From: "Drew Jacobs" From Bev: >A3: OK. The million dollar question. Roy has made it pretty plain >that be is not interested in re-forming the 'Move'. He's also shown >no objection to a re-formation of the band without him. I'd be >genuinely interested in what everyone who logs on to 'useless >information' thinks about this. Would you attend a 'Woodless' Move >performance? It's okay with me as long as Jeff Lynne takes his place! Drew Jacobs Latham, NY ********** Subject: Re-formation of The Move Date: Mon, 17 Feb 2003 16:25:21 -0800 From: "Duncan Haig" Well, where to start? The Move without Roy would not be The Move. I would wish such a band all the best but, as with most long-term fans, I would not go out of my way to see them, or to buy their product. However, If there is the slightest prospect of the original line-up re-forming, I would go to great lengths to support it. We should be realistic, however, and appreciate that the integrity with which these legendary musicians approach their profession at present would preclude them from reforming simply to become part of the current revival circuit (God forbid!), and their present committments would also preclude them from reforming on anything other than an occasional project basis. For it to happen, Roy should be approached by someone from the mailing list in whom he has the greatest trust, with the proposition that he participate in an occasional Move project, which would be gig, rather than recording based. If his agreement is secured, the other members should then be approached. If his agreement is not secured, the project should be forgotten. Although I got into the band through the singles, I have long since been aware that the essence of The Move was their live performance of other writers' quality material, mainly west-coast American, upon which they imposed their unique heavy harmony interpretation. The gig should primarily showcase such material, with the singles being presented only in medley form, with exceptions such as I Can hear The Grass Grow and Wild Tiger Woman. If the other guys agreed, songs such as Looking On and Turkish Tram Conductor Blues could be added. This should satisfy the likes of Trevor, who we know grew dissatisfied with the demands of audiences who only wished to hear the singles, good as they were. No pressure should be placed on Roy to write new material. Constant reality checks should be placed on any such project, should it progress beyond the planning stage. The guys would have to understand that gig attendance might not be high, but that appreciation of their willingness to perform again would be immeasurable amongst those who do attend. The five should be asked to cast their minds back to the days when they were, perhaps, the best live band in the country and to ask themselves whether they wish to recapture some of that quality and excitement, as we certainly do. Respect should be given to all of their current lives and projects (such as Carl with The Hollies), and no long-term committment should be suggested. Regarding Roy, unless he is perfectly happy with things at present, it does seem that his talent requires to be harnessed and channelled. It is evident from the mailings I read that this man occupies our thoughts for much of each waking day, and yet we (and perhaps Roy himself) live in the dark regarding his current and future moves. It is an unhappy situation, made more so by the suspicion that Roy himself may be musically frustrated. Drawing him back to the majestic peaks of his younger musical life might be the tonic he requires to press on with other projects. At his age, there is plenty of time to re-energise his career. We live in hope for the future, but with gratitude for the music already made. Duncan Haig, Aberdeen ********** Subject: Retiremant? What retirement? Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 09:48:25 GMT From: kakman1 Since the question was asked, and Bev is the one who appears to be seriously feeling out how the fans on this list would feel about any kind of reunion, does this mean Bev is itching to get back on the road again after retiring from ELO Part II? Since Roy has already indicated to Bev he would not object to a reformation of The Move, albeit without Roy's participation, it sounds like Bev is already beginning to get his ducks in a row. I still don't see Trevor or Chris signing on again, at least on a full time basis. If Carl does seem agreeable to a full time re-activated Move with Bev, it'll be a done deal. The question remains whether this will be a full time rock'n'roll cabaret oldies act (ah, irony again!) or something closer to the original band's rock'n'roll / r&b live act. The latter I would see, support and spend money on, even if they didn't play one note of 'Blackberry Way', 'Flowers In The Rain' or 'I Can Hear The Grass Grow'. If only they'd come to Texas;0) Kevin Kunreuther Dallas TX NP: Trevor Burton Band - "Blue Moons", The Heartache End of Useless Information #447 ******************************* [This digest is the copyright of the Move "Useless Information" Mailing List. Re-publication or re-distribution of "Useless Information" content, in any form whatsoever, is expressly prohibited without prior written consent.]